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20:32:31 <str4d> Hi all
20:34:53 <str4d> 0) Hi
20:34:53 <str4d> 1) TODO 0.9.13-0.9.16 http://zzz.i2p/topics/1600
20:34:53 <str4d> 2) New transport for Tor PTs http://zzz.i2p/topics/1551
20:34:53 <str4d> 3) Any items that emerge from 1)
20:34:53 <str4d> Post-meeting activity: Stress-testing Mumble (voice chat over I2P)
20:35:07 <iRelay> Title: zzz.i2p: TODO 0.9.13 - 0.9.16 (at zzz.i2p)
20:35:10 <iRelay> Title: zzz.i2p: Supporting Tor Pluggable Transports (at zzz.i2p)
20:35:29 <str4d> 0) Hi
20:35:57 <hottuna> Hello
20:37:37 <str4d> Anyone else?
20:38:01 <str4d> zzz2 orion psi kytv meeh_
20:41:17 <str4d> Hopefully some of them will turn up.
20:41:17 <str4d> 1) TODO 0.9.13-0.9.16 http://zzz.i2p/topics/1600
20:41:22 <iRelay> Title: zzz.i2p: TODO 0.9.13 - 0.9.16 (at zzz.i2p)
20:41:26 <zzz2> here
20:41:58 <str4d> At zzz's request we started a discussion thread to propose ideas for the I2P roadmap moving forward.
20:42:27 <str4d> There was a lot of chatter, but no actual consensus was reached.
20:43:14 <str4d> I summarized some of the initial suggestions on the roadmap page http://trac.i2p2.i2p/wiki/Roadmaps/1.0
20:43:17 <iRelay> Title: Roadmaps/1.0 – I2P Bugtracker (at trac.i2p2.i2p)
20:45:01 <str4d> zzz2: I see you have been getting stuck into susimail (yay)
20:46:19 <zzz2> yeah, fell down that rathole while we try to decide what's really important
20:52:07 <str4d> I think that it was useful work, if only because there is a long-standing bug about login problems, and susimail is one of the first apps that users are going to try
20:52:08 <str4d> http://trac.i2p2.i2p/ticket/747
20:52:12 <iRelay> Title: #747 (Login problems with Susimail) – I2P Bugtracker (at trac.i2p2.i2p)
20:54:45 <psi> str4d: ohai
20:54:47 * psi is late?
20:55:19 <str4d> yes psi is
20:55:25 <str4d> Nothing much has happened yet :/
20:55:58 * psi scrolls up
20:56:07 <str4d> To summarize what has been going on since the RFC was put out:
20:56:18 <str4d> - zzz has worked on susimail
20:56:59 <str4d> - psi has been getting his head around PTs, new DH and JNI
20:57:23 <str4d> - I have been working on I2P-Bote Android, and now Java EdDSA
20:57:39 * psi has been spending the entire day fleshing out the structure of PT for i2p
20:58:59 <zzz2> if str4d and psi are making progress on EdDSA, 25519, and PTs, then I think the best use of my time is moving forward on new sig algo migration, e.g. multiple dests down a tunnel, and some sort of addressbook support
21:00:27 <jenkins@kyirc> Starting build #581 for job I2P
21:01:01 <zzz2> whats the status of psi mtn keys and dev agreement? I've gotten nothing in the mail.
21:01:23 <str4d> psi signed the dev agreement, I pushed it to the website
21:01:36 <str4d> (so his pub keys are on record)
21:02:10 <zzz2> his key fingerprint is on there too?
21:02:32 <zzz2> if so I'll add him and announce it
21:03:02 <psi> my gpg fp is on my twitter
21:03:05 <str4d> not the fingerprint, but the key itself is
21:03:47 <zzz2> it needs to be in that sample monotonerc template file. psi maybe you can do that as your first test of mtn skills?
21:04:23 <jenkins@kyirc> Yippee, build fixed!
21:04:24 <jenkins@kyirc> Project I2P build #581: FIXED in 3 min 55 sec: http://jenkins.killyourtv.i2p/job/I2P/581/
21:04:36 <psi> i can get that
21:04:40 <psi> i already did that locally
21:04:53 <str4d> zzz2, psi, I have updated the roadmap Gantt - http://trac.i2p2.i2p/wiki/Roadmaps/1.0
21:04:56 <iRelay> Title: Roadmaps/1.0 – I2P Bugtracker (at trac.i2p2.i2p)
21:05:21 <psi> the monotone key fp for my NOT transport key is "1ceb85b992114bae1bcb156ef238f8f3044a6bfe", -- ampernand@gmail.com
21:06:04 <psi> i can get my transport key fp as well
21:06:29 <zzz2> ok great, welcome to the team! As I tell everybody, please be careful, practice on www first
21:06:30 <str4d> psi: you need to send that to eche, kytv and welt
21:06:43 <str4d> +1
21:06:56 * kytv got it and is adding it to his server
21:07:08 <zzz2> psi, we have very precise instructions on how to do all this on the web page... :)
21:07:27 <psi> i will review that
21:07:38 <zzz2> e.g., send me mail (but no longer needed for you)
21:08:15 <str4d> How does the Gantt roadmap look to everyone now? Are there any items that seem unrealistic, or any that are missing
21:08:16 <str4d> ?
21:09:37 * psi reviews roadmap
21:09:43 <jenkins@kyirc> Project I2P UnitTests build #528: SUCCESS in 5 min 6 sec: http://jenkins.killyourtv.i2p/job/UnitTests/528/
21:09:57 <jenkins@kyirc> Starting build #82 for job I2P-Android
21:09:59 <str4d> zzz2: I suggest that you get the new GPG keys item out of the way sooner rather than later ;)
21:10:19 <zzz2> str4d, please tell us what it's telling you about what's important
21:10:33 <str4d> psi: are you finding much overlap between your PTs work and NTCP2?
21:10:34 <zzz2> yes I'll do it before the next release, I promise
21:11:24 <str4d> IMHO there are three things that are important:
21:11:32 <jenkins@kyirc> Project I2P-Android build #82: SUCCESS in 1 min 34 sec: http://jenkins.killyourtv.i2p/job/I2P-Android/82/
21:11:40 <str4d> 1) progress on the crypto upgrade - now finally getting underway
21:12:01 <psi> str4d: at the moment, i have yet to look at ntcp2
21:12:13 <str4d> (continuing on from the prep work)
21:13:28 <zzz2> 1) "now getting underway" ? I've been busting ass on it for 6 months
21:13:32 <str4d> 2) Audit prep - IMHO we need to get on top of our threat model etc. ASAP
21:15:33 * psi afks for 30 minutes
21:15:33 <psi> unexpected event bbl
21:15:33 <psi> i will look at scrollback later
21:16:21 <zzz2> There seems to be some confusion out there about "new signing crypto". It's done, it's out there in 0.9.12, it works. For destinations.
21:17:06 <zzz2> The "only" thing not done is migrating existing published destinations to a new one.
21:21:13 <str4d> yes, which first relies on choosing a new one, which IMHO should be Ed25519, which relies on getting a fast impl.
21:21:15 <str4d> And at the same time, I agree that the remaining required migration infrastructure should be implemented.
21:21:16 <str4d> <str4d> For years we have left it to the side and worked on what we think is beneficial to users, but IMHO if we want to start getting more research interest, and utilize it effectively, we need to be more conscious of what I2P can and cannot achieve.
21:21:17 <str4d> <str4d> I know you have zzz ;P
21:21:18 <str4d> <str4d> (I was specifically referring to the part of it involving the actual new crypto)
21:21:19 <str4d> <str4d> thank you for the effort you have put into getting it this far :)
21:21:20 <str4d> <str4d> 3) Usability, UX - this is a third important point that is not on the Roadmap chart
21:21:22 <str4d> <str4d> Well - zzz's susimail work falls into that category, as does streaming improvements
21:21:41 <str4d> <str4d> But also important is reviewing our error and help pages, and how we aid the user in getting their jobs done.
21:21:41 <str4d> (after my "2) Audit prep" line)
21:22:00 <str4d> I need to go AFK in 10-15 mins
21:22:50 <str4d> And since psi is AFK, I'm dropping "2) New transport for Tor PTs" from this meeting
21:23:55 <str4d> zzz2: in your opinion, what do we need to do before organizing a meeting with Lance re: threat model?
21:24:59 * str4d would like to try for a meeting with Lance in May
21:26:04 <str4d> so we need to work out what we need to do before then, so we can organize the meeting with enough time to finish that first.
21:29:27 <zzz2> I disagree that we first have to choose.
21:29:59 <zzz2> Or, that we can choose now (P256) and choose again later when more options are available.
21:30:02 <MTN@kyirc> [ I2P ] compile fix [zzz@mail.i2p] http://killyourtv.i2p/viewmtn/revision/info/12396c3ee88d1194482fc2cc3751db1169cc52e3
21:30:34 <zzz2> We could switch the default for new dests to P256 in 0.9.13 if we want.
21:30:35 <str4d> zzz2: if we get to the stage where the naming system can cope with dynamic enc choices, then I agree
21:31:05 <zzz2> P256 is clearly better than DSA
21:31:34 <str4d> I also agree there.
21:31:43 <zzz2> I think the P256 haters better take a step back and think about how bad DSA 1024 is.
21:32:03 <MTN@kyirc> [ WWW ] adding psi's transport key [kytv@mail.i2p] http://killyourtv.i2p/viewmtn/revision/info/029163d2d446f10ab1a129b559802fabac2ef8b7
21:32:52 <str4d> zzz2: I understand your point.
21:33:39 <zzz2> re: audit and Lance, it's always a good time. you have an audit process update for us from the mailing list?
21:33:40 <str4d> Part of my reason for wanting to get EdDSA working before the switch is that based on what you have said in threads before, I wouldn't look forward to switching Dest signing algo twice.
21:34:14 <str4d> yes, the second time would be a bit easier because multi dest support etc. would be there, but the naming side is still the weakness.
21:34:48 <zzz2> for servers you don't want to switch twice, but for clients it doesnt matter
21:35:04 <str4d> good point.
21:35:23 <str4d> Is there anything that would prevent new Dests talking with old ones?
21:35:31 <nombre_> so i gather you guys are doing crypto upgrades? is there perhaps a page that goes into detail on what all you're planning? and on a 25519 implementation, you could just use nacl via jni, or kalium, tho that might be somewhat limiting
21:35:34 <zzz2> and even for servers, if you switch to P256 it hardly seems worth it to switch again, unless some really bad news comes out about P256
21:35:54 <str4d> If not, it could be a good idea to get clients onto P256 sooner
21:36:08 <zzz2> new dests can talk to old and vice versa, as long as both are on 0.9.12 or later
21:36:39 <str4d> zzz2: http://blog.cr.yp.to/20140323-ecdsa.html is reason enough for me to not want to stay on ECDSA
21:36:43 <iRelay> Title: cr.yp.to: 2014.03.23: How to design an elliptic-curve signature system (at blog.cr.yp.to)
21:37:56 <str4d> not for any one single point (yet), but if we can get an effective, *correct* implementation of EdDSA, I think it would be very beneficial to switch
21:38:27 <str4d> nombre_: http://trac.i2p2.i2p/ticket/856
21:38:30 <iRelay> Title: #856 (Crypto review/migration) – I2P Bugtracker (at trac.i2p2.i2p)
21:38:30 <str4d> (and links therein)
21:38:40 <nombre_> thx str4d
21:38:53 <zzz2> nothing there tells me to delay getting rid of DSA though. There's nothing in there that makes me panic about P256 either. Is there anything better than P256? sure.
21:39:15 <str4d> zzz2: no real updates as such from the OpenITP mailing list, there hasn't been much real activity lately.
21:40:38 <zzz2> I allowed for 65536 signing algos and I implemented 7. 65529 to go, we can add a few every release if we like.
21:43:27 <str4d> zzz, I would support moving clients to p256 in 0.9.13
21:44:47 <str4d> but if the server transition is still not going to be smooth, I'd rayher hold off a bit and see how EdDSA work goes.
21:45:49 <nombre_> as would i (not that my opinion counts for anything), nist ecdsa is better than dsa, even if some of us tinfoilers won't feel secure until its 25519
21:46:48 <nombre_> dest/b32 breaking is sorta a given tho yes?
21:47:13 <str4d> it's taken a long time and a lot of work to get to this point, no sense rushing at the last minute
21:49:48 * RN pokes head in and looks around
21:54:36 <zzz2> there's 1) clients 2) new servers and 3) existing server migration.
21:54:43 <zzz2> 1 and 2 we can do now, 3) takes a lot more work.
21:54:59 <zzz2> 1 and 2 breaks compatibility with old routers, i2pcpp, and i2pd though, until they catch up
21:55:16 <nombre_> so is there someone working on finding/creating a java implementation of 25519? and whats the estimated timeframe on when it would be usable?
21:55:28 <nombre_> i assume with p256, its already doable because thats included in bouncy castle?
21:55:52 <zzz2> p256 is in the jvm
21:56:06 <nombre_> ah even better
21:56:17 <zzz2> we have 25519 java now but it's far too slow to be usable. str4d and psi are trying to speed it up
21:57:39 <nombre_> hmm well not knowing anything about crypto, i would think using jni would be the simplest way to speed it up. perhaps i should look into 25519 more to understand what parts of it are the bottlenecks
23:02:36 <str4d> No one actually ended it when I went afk, so:
23:02:53 * str4d *baf*s the meeting closed.

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I2P dev meeting, April 22, 2014 @ 20:30 UTC
===========================================
Quick recap
-----------
* **Present:**
hottuna,
nombre_,
psi,
str4d,
zzz2

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20:00:37 <zzz> http://zzz.i2p/topics/1618
20:00:43 <bgwcb> well, start it?
20:00:46 <iRelay> Title: zzz.i2p: Meeting Tues. May 6 - 8 PM UTC (at zzz.i2p)
20:00:57 <zzz> 0. Hi
20:00:57 <zzz> 1. hiddengate.i2p console home page request (see next post for details)
20:00:57 <zzz> 2. OMGWTFBBQ Summer Europe - echelon
20:00:57 <zzz> 3. 0.9.13 release schedule
20:01:06 <zzz> 0. Hi
20:01:09 <zzz> hello
20:01:11 <eche|on> hi!
20:01:15 <psi> hello
20:01:16 <topiltzin> hi
20:01:23 <nombra> o/ (reconnected just in time)
20:01:38 <kytv> hola
20:01:49 <Yi> what is it?
20:01:50 <zzz> Most of these items should be short, let's limit them to 15 minutes each
20:02:00 <hghoster> hi all
20:02:05 * mokosoul sneaks away before anyone notices it was here at the meeting.
20:02:08 <zzz> 1. hiddengate.i2p console home page request
20:02:16 <zzz> see the link above for details
20:02:42 <zzz> hghoster is the requester for hiddengate.i2p. would you please tell us a little about the site?
20:03:52 <hghoster> HiddenGate is a project for Russian I2P users. Target: publish online/offline "Vestnik I2P" paper which introducec to I2P and guides how to reach it.
20:04:00 <hghoster> we have wiki, forum, imboard
20:04:06 <EinMByte> Hi
20:04:47 <EinMByte> hghoster: so... can we say it's a kind of help-site
20:05:03 <hghoster> so.. we already published first version of paper. also few guys continues fill wiki with new techinal articles
20:05:04 <kytv> for convenience, the ToS in EN: http://hiddengate.i2p/wiki/ToS#Terms_of_Service
20:05:04 <zzz> ok, thanks. Anybody have questions or comments? I especially would like comments from Russian speakers
20:05:08 <iRelay> Title: HiddenGate Wiki:Описание — HiddenGate Wiki (at hiddengate.i2p)
20:05:27 <bgwcb> hghoster: censored imageboard, but it's probably good because we, good russian anonymous, don't love cp
20:05:29 <EinMByte> I've visited the website earlier, and it looks good
20:05:50 <EinMByte> one thing I would like to mention though: the homepage is all in russian
20:05:55 <hghoster> EinMByte: yes. our target is to make some platform where is new users will not see cp, etc some shock content
20:06:15 <hghoster> just for politics discussions, some interests, etc. no trash, no cp
20:06:48 <hghoster> EinMByte: but there is one or two pages in English, for example ToS. wait a mmt plz
20:07:08 <EinMByte> So, maybe an english introduction would be nice?
20:07:08 <EinMByte> (even if the rest of the site is in russian)
20:07:08 <EinMByte> That sounds good
20:07:14 <zzz> hghoster has posted a English and Russian ToS as required: http://hiddengate.i2p/wiki/ToS
20:07:18 <iRelay> Title: HiddenGate Wiki:Описание — HiddenGate Wiki (at hiddengate.i2p)
20:07:20 <EinMByte> zzz: considering the amount of russian users, I think this would be a good addition
20:07:22 <hghoster> zzz thank you
20:07:48 <EinMByte> Well, I'd just like at least one english sentence on the homepage
20:08:05 <EinMByte> because visiting hiddengate.i2p was quite confusing for me
20:08:31 <EinMByte> and I suppose it would be like that for most non-russian I2P users
20:08:45 <EinMByte> nevertheless, I do agree with the proposal
20:09:18 <zzz> any other comments from the Russian users here - bgwcb denixx_ Nyakov ?
20:09:38 <hghoster> we may place some welcome text on the top of first page explainig for non-russian users where they are
20:10:12 <EinMByte> hghoster: this is what I mean
20:10:19 <hghoster> i'm logging our converstation and we'll discuss it later too
20:10:21 <hghoster> i think they may sleep :) but bgwcb not
20:10:22 <Nyakov> I think this is good idea
20:10:36 <bgwcb> i think if hiddengate get in start-home page it fill hiddengate of some good content
20:10:37 <hghoster> okay, i'll remember this, thank you
20:10:49 <EinMByte> After all, I assume that's what users coming from the control panel will see: the front page
20:10:49 <zzz> hghoster, I got some comments last week in #ru that your site had very little content on it. What are your plans to add more content?
20:10:53 <Yi> i think it's ok
20:11:12 <zzz> we do not want "dead" sites on our home page
20:11:17 <user@kyirc> +1 for the welcome sentence. the domain name is in English and I could have gotten to the site too, and then not even knowing what it is is kinda frutrating, even if the rest will be unintelligible for me anyway
20:11:53 <bgwcb> and it's good idea because they heaven't cp. new arrivals may be affraid darkness networks because it's shelter for pedofiles and terrorists
20:11:59 <hghoster> certainly plans are good :) there is another guy "Glavred", he is idea-creator of this project. i am workiing on it like admin. also there is few guys who continuing fill wiki
20:12:37 <hghoster> offcourse it fills not so fast as we want. but we continue our work anyway. until someone like mr. P will not close internets
20:12:48 <bgwcb> but, then i will be want to get on start page http://rus.i2p with comment it's have a some shock-content
20:12:50 <hghoster> sorry for my poor english
20:13:00 <iRelay> Title: Русская I2P Wiki (at rus.i2p)
20:13:13 <zzz> no need for sorry, you are doing fine :)(
20:13:40 <zzz> ok, any other comments? I have not heard any objection so far?
20:13:53 <dg> Sounds good to me.
20:13:54 <EinMByte> zzz: regarding "dead" sites - look at it like this: if a site makes the homepage, this may very well increase traffic
20:14:09 <EinMByte> so, that could have a positive effect on content too
20:14:12 <dg> Furthermore, we can always remove a site if it's 'dead'
20:14:21 <EinMByte> exactly
20:14:45 <kytv> no issues here, but an introductory sentence or two in English (to match the language of the hostname) would be welcome.
20:15:26 <user@kyirc> the console tooltip could/should already mention it's in Russian. am pro
20:16:08 <hghoster> site is hosting outside of russia, so i think there no problems with it. also i'm c++er and have good work, so money not a problem. the main thing is how to propagand i2p more effectively. we hope that paper helps us
20:16:32 <hghoster> kytv: yes, certainly
20:16:48 <zzz> ok then, hghoster we approve your request and I will add it for 0.9.13. Thanks for attending the meeting and good luck with your site
20:16:48 <bgwcb> i'm for it to appear on front-page
20:16:48 <zzz> thanks also to our friends from #ru for helping us out
20:16:50 <psi> (c++ers are invited to help with i2pd and i2pcpp) <-- off topic
20:16:59 <zzz> moving on
20:16:59 <zzz> 2. OMGWTFBBQ Summer Europe - echelon
20:17:01 <zzz> eche|on, tell us about it
20:17:03 <hghoster> thank you all!
20:17:08 <bgwcb> thank you all it was an interesting
20:17:19 <eche|on> the BBQ
20:17:38 <eche|on> we always wanted to do a BBQ, I can offer to host one in this summer, in graz, austria
20:17:45 <eche|on> if we want to do one
20:18:18 <eche|on> money for drinks/food is available in funds IMHO, just the part about people to visit this BBQ is a topic...
20:18:28 <EinMByte> would be nice, but I would probably not attend (for reasons of anonimity)
20:18:35 <zzz> when?
20:18:46 <eche|on> I am more about end of august, september timeframe
20:19:21 <zzz> not to conflict with DEFCON, first week of August
20:19:33 <eche|on> right, I know
20:19:48 <bgwcb> It's good idea
20:19:58 <EinMByte> zzz: can I quickly append two things: one question about just mail, another about derbycon (offtopic, sorry)
20:20:11 <psi> on the topic of conferences orion and I are going to probably most likely be at derbycon
20:20:17 <eche|on> and I know not much people will come over, and I can only provide a place for bbq, no sleeping facility
20:20:23 <zzz> EinMByte, you will be number 4 on the agenda
20:20:33 <EinMByte> zzz: thanks
20:20:46 <zzz> psi, derbycon will be number 5 on the agenda
20:20:52 <psi> okay
20:20:56 <EinMByte> eche|on: bbq is definitely a good idea
20:21:05 <EinMByte> iff you can get enough people to attend
20:21:38 <bgwcb> but why is hosting outside of russia?
20:21:38 <zzz> anybody who is interested in a Graz BBQ late August / early Sept., please type "yes" or "maybe"
20:21:53 <EinMByte> zzz: attending or just support
20:22:09 <zzz> attending.
20:22:15 <zzz> I will say "maybe"
20:22:37 <bgwcb> maybe
20:22:56 <psi> "maybe" (if i can get there which is a very unlikely thing)
20:23:11 <eche|on> hm, I think I will start a questionaire in forum.i2p ?
20:23:26 <eche|on> graz is very good reachable by plane via Frankfurt ;-)
20:23:40 <eche|on> but thats expansive. I do know.
20:24:14 <zzz> eche|on, not a lot of support... perhaps a meetup or BBQ at a conference would be more popular?
20:24:17 <EinMByte> I too think it's best to move this matter to a forum or something
20:24:51 <bgwcb> where owned?
20:24:52 <eche|on> zzz: that would be better. if we find a conf which fits?
20:24:52 <bgwcb> sorry, where exactly
20:24:54 <EinMByte> 5?
20:24:54 <bgwcb> ?
20:24:55 <zzz> I would love a meetup in summertime, but combined with conf may make more sense
20:24:57 <eche|on> this year I do not have time to get to Las Vegas
20:25:45 <eche|on> (again)
20:25:48 <eche|on> but if you want to do something, the cash is available^^
20:25:48 <zzz> ok, lets defer this topic for more research, maybe we can talk again in a couple weeks with ideas
20:25:48 <eche|on> I keep a eye on this
20:26:03 <EinMByte> good
20:26:14 <zzz> moving on
20:26:18 <zzz> 3. 0.9.13 release schedule
20:26:46 <zzz> we're about 4 weeks since 0.9.12 and our normal 5-8 week cycle gives us a release in late May
20:27:02 <dg> only 4..
20:27:11 <zzz> rfree has been doing good research on the problems in 0.9.12 with firewalled routers and that -14 seems to help a lot
20:27:17 <EinMByte> what about those supposed problems with 0.9.12, have they been resolved (if there were any)?
20:27:19 <zzz> so he's recommending a release soon.
20:27:28 <EinMByte> oh right
20:27:50 <zzz> it seems to be only with firewalled routers, but that means all TAILS users too
20:27:56 <eche|on> zzz: how far have you come with susimail, done?
20:28:12 <zzz> yes I'm about done with susimail for now
20:28:24 <eche|on> ok, and Tails, next release at which date?
20:28:25 <zzz> so susimail + firewall fixes sounds good enough for a release
20:28:32 <eche|on> aka which date we need to be done?
20:28:33 <zzz> so maybe in either 2 weeks or 3?
20:28:58 <user@kyirc> -0 was bad for me, on lin, nonfirewalld, -4 fix reachablility. then on xp with firewall -0 was alsmot unusable. -14 works great
20:29:04 <eche|on> currently no problem with a shorter cycle
20:29:24 <user@kyirc> dunno about the console locking prob though, which was on -14
20:29:36 <zzz> checkin deadline May 16 or 23, and release May 19 or 26
20:29:47 <eche|on> may 16 would be better (29th is holiday)
20:29:50 <dg> I say 16/19 provided there's no deadlocks and stuff.
20:30:10 <dg> If user's still suffering, hold off.
20:31:10 <zzz> OK let's shoot for the 16th for a deadline and a release on the 19th. If we have unresolved problems then we will push it back
20:31:20 <EinMByte> ok
20:31:45 <user@kyirc> on the xp it's perfectly fine. the console thingy in MY case can be caused by myself, since I tried a plugin that was still depending on an older version of jetty. maybe that changed something in my settings, for the problems remained after removing the plugins. but that's just in MY case
20:32:14 <user@kyirc> if no one else has that problem, then -14 is a good release candidate, imho
20:32:49 <zzz> moving on: 4) EinMByte Just Mail
20:32:49 <EinMByte> yes, just a minor question
20:32:49 <EinMByte> orion: ding
20:32:54 <EinMByte> So my question was: has orion been able to get in touch
20:33:07 <EinMByte> and second of all: what the hell are they doing
20:33:16 <EinMByte> imho, it doesn't seem like it can work
20:33:20 <zzz> he got a reply and copied me, it didn't really say much
20:33:26 <EinMByte> so I think they need some advice
20:33:30 <EinMByte> zzz: could you paste
20:33:38 <EinMByte> I'm interested
20:34:04 <EinMByte> as I wrote on http://zzz.i2p/topics/1614, I doubt about their ideas
20:34:10 <iRelay> Title: zzz.i2p: Just Mail Kickstarter (at zzz.i2p)
20:34:28 <EinMByte> * the feasability of their ideas
20:35:09 <zzz> I'll paste it onto that thread after the meeting.. It's just marketing b.s., doesn't really explain anything.
20:35:26 <EinMByte> alright, thanks
20:35:44 <zzz> anything else on Just Mail?
20:35:47 <EinMByte> I think that will do for 4, it doesn't seem like this is going to work out
20:36:12 <EinMByte> (I'm sorry for the people who invested in it, too)
20:36:25 <zzz> moving on
20:36:37 <zzz> 5) DerbyCon EinMByte psi orion
20:36:55 <psi> i believe that orion and I will be able to attend derbycon
20:37:00 <EinMByte> again, I wanted to know the status on that
20:37:07 <EinMByte> okay, any talks yet?
20:37:20 <psi> i was hoping you two could give one
20:37:29 <zzz> http://zzz.i2p/topics/1579
20:37:33 <iRelay> Title: zzz.i2p: Derbycon Louisville Sept. 24-28 (at zzz.i2p)
20:37:44 <EinMByte> zzz: no chance of you giving a talk?
20:38:20 <zzz> A chance, but I vote for our PR guy orion
20:38:24 <EinMByte> also, does anyone know whether or not these talks are being broadcasted?
20:38:50 <psi> if they are you could always dress like the unibomber (str4d)
20:39:25 <zzz> psi, orion, I recommend you contact Adrian immediately to find out the CFP schedule and process and find out what kind of talk would be appropriate
20:39:35 <psi> okay
20:39:46 <zzz> This is mainly an InfoSec conf, much different from DEFCON/HOPE/CCC etc
20:40:39 <EinMByte> It is important that we have a talk, because that will definitely spread the word
20:40:54 <EinMByte> (also more chance of academic research)
20:41:13 <zzz> speaking of HOPE: http://zzz.i2p/topics/1507
20:41:19 <iRelay> Title: zzz.i2p: HOPE X (at zzz.i2p)
20:41:36 <zzz> and DEFCON: http://zzz.i2p/topics/1556
20:41:42 <iRelay> Title: zzz.i2p: DEFCON 2014 (at zzz.i2p)
20:42:07 <zzz> anyway, psi and orion, if you guys go to DerbyCon there's a chance I'll go too.
20:42:18 <zzz> eche|on, Louisville BBQ?
20:42:22 <EinMByte> in an ideal world, we'd have a talk on all of those conferences
20:42:30 <psi> ooh that sounds nice, BBQ in KT
20:42:51 <zzz> KY
20:43:02 <psi> it's KY? dang
20:43:50 <zzz> two or three of you should co-author a talk and leave me out of it. That would be best :)
20:44:00 <zzz> anything else for the meeting?
20:44:10 * zzz warms up the baffer
20:44:14 <user@kyirc> it's not a topic on the agenda, but I think, we should start thinking about our official in-network homepage. www.i2p2.i2p is ugly. it was chosen in order to match the public internet domain of i2p2.de. since this one is not our main address anymore, we should also think about a nicer in-network domain. i2p.i2p for instance. dunno if geti2p.i2p makes sense, as you don't need to _get_ i2p anymore.
20:44:23 <eche|on> zzz: louiesville, time, place?
20:44:39 <zzz> http://zzz.i2p/topics/1579
20:44:44 <iRelay> Title: zzz.i2p: Derbycon Louisville Sept. 24-28 (at zzz.i2p)
20:44:53 <user@kyirc> not urgent, but maybe something to think about, and easy to "fix"
20:45:22 <EinMByte> yes, new homepage would be nice
20:45:22 <eche|on> hm, at this date I wanted to be in scotland
20:45:30 <zzz> user, that's welterde. In the router console we have removed all references, we now point to i2p-projekt.i2p
20:45:59 <user@kyirc> which is not perfect either, because of the k
20:45:59 <zzz> thanks everybody for a good meeting
20:46:09 <eche|on> would need a check on timetables
20:46:20 <EinMByte> zzz: one last thing, do you plan on having regular meetings
20:46:30 <user@kyirc> as it's a link it's not that much of a problem, but still an english-language name would be better, imho
20:46:44 <EinMByte> (unless that's already the case?)
20:47:02 <zzz> EinMByte, we schedule meetings as-needed. Anybody can schedule a meeting at any time for any topic.
20:47:17 <EinMByte> zzz: alright
20:47:23 <user@kyirc> what's wrong with i2p-project.i2p ? already registered by someone else?
20:47:47 <eche|on> but louisville is nice to reach and central
20:47:50 <zzz> EinMByte, http://zzz.i2p/topics/1491
20:47:55 <iRelay> Title: zzz.i2p: Project Meetings (at zzz.i2p)
20:48:37 <EinMByte> I'm thinking about an i2pcpp meeting
20:48:42 <EinMByte> but I need to discuss with orion
20:48:44 <zzz> if we are going to DerbyCon we should try to convince Lance to go too
20:50:03 <eche|on> ok, I keep this in head and I went off for bed
20:50:04 <eche|on> cya later
20:50:19 <zzz> any talk will have to be kickass to be accepted. DerbyCon was small the first year but this is the 4th year I think. We have a little bit of inside track with irongeek but it's not just his show.
20:50:55 <EinMByte> btw, I'm willing to look at slides etc etc. Not sure if it would help a lot but you never know
20:51:51 <EinMByte> anyway, bye

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I2P dev meeting, May 6, 2014 @ 20:00 UTC
========================================
Quick recap
-----------
* **Present:**
bgwcb,
dg,
eche|on,
EinMByte,
hghoster,
kytv,
nombra,
Nyakov,
psi,
topiltzin,
user,
Yi,
zzz,